Hello Oliver, I'm delighted to be here today.

And that brings me to my first question.It's not yet common practice everywhere to be on first-name terms with a manager from HR Development.Is this also a sign of New Work?

Maybe a little bit, but even at HHLA, it's not common to be on first-name terms everywhere. It varies depending on the area or level. I really like working with the first name and I have the feeling that this is becoming more and more common. I think it's good to let it develop organically, and it's also totally legitimate that not everyone on the Executive Board wants to be on first-name terms with everyone, for example. In HR development, we like to work with the first name because it creates closeness and makes it easier to start conversations.

New Work” already contains new things and curiosity.I assume you are a curious person by nature?

Yes, I would say so. I think that's also a bit part of doing my job. Sometimes I'm almost a bit too interested, because the large field of learning content and the view of organizations and working environments offers a lot of material to be curious about. On the contrary, I sometimes need a focus here and there in order to concentrate on what is really important.

Has personal curiosity become a more important quality for managers and employees today?

I don't know if it has become more important, but it has probably always been important. Perhaps it has become even more important because things are changing even faster than they did 100 years ago. If we look at technological progress, then I have to remain curious to a certain extent today, because the technologies I start my career with will be different when I go out.

How does this great importance of curiosity fit in with HHLA's corporate culture?

Very well, I would say. It's part of our DNA, especially when you think about our core business, the container segment. We have always been involved in change and have actively helped to shape it. There are always opportunities for curiosity and innovation, and I really like that. Especially when you talk to colleagues from Terminal Development or from HHLA Next, which is specifically concerned with new business ideas and start-up models, there are an incredible number of curious people who need to try out new things and see where we can improve a little.

I mentioned it at the beginning: at first glance, many New Work topics seem to fit better in an office-only world than in a port.So does New Work have completely different aspects for you and your HR development than for an office-based company?

I would say yes and no. The original approach behind this theory of work was more of a critique of the economic system as it functioned at the time. The revolutionary idea was to focus more on the fulfillment of meaning. In this respect, I find it very exciting that we now use the term New Work as a catch-all for new working methods, for table football, for more flexibility. For me, it's much more exciting to look at how we can make work better. Right where it happens and with the opportunities that are available.

That is also my next question.Everywhere in the economy, but especially in the port, technical developments are changing work.Trainees today, for example, have to fear that their profession will look completely different in a decade's time or that it will no longer exist in this form.Is this actually a new phenomenon?

First of all, I don't think that trainees need to be afraid. On the contrary: they have a huge opportunity today because they come into the company with a completely different naturalness when it comes to using technology. This allows them to help shape the future right from the start. Even more so, the faster these developments continue. In this respect: Fear is not necessary. On the contrary, we place a great deal of trust in our young talents and trainees, who have a completely different kind of natural ability to deal with greater dynamism and technological advances. But of course, training professions are also evolving. That's something we look at and ask: which specialist training occupations continue to offer our colleagues good prospects for the future?

How quickly and in what way do job profiles change in the port?Do you have an example?

Over the next one to two years, we will be dealing with the fact that more and more work will be done remotely. There are already some devices out in the port today - and there will be even more in the future - that are no longer controlled on the large equipment itself, but remotely. Today, this does not yet happen in the home office, but still at the terminal on site. But of course, this will change everyday working life enormously.

Yes, even harbor tugs can already be controlled remotely from a terminal, at least in model tests, theoretically without a crew being on board.

Exactly, and there are also examples of ports where individual tasks are even operated remotely from other countries. Another example from the technical professions: Nowadays, devices not only have screws in them, but also a lot of software. In other words, this plays a very important role in training professions today, especially in technical fields.

You've actually already answered part of the question I wanted to ask.If you think about automation and the advance, what makes HHLA attractive as a training provider?

Again, I would say that it's not what makes HHLA attractive despite this, but precisely because of it. For young people who have just left school, it is extremely exciting to get to grips with AI topics, for example.

All these processes and developments and new fields of technology that you have already mentioned will change work in the port in a comprehensive way.New work in the literal sense.How are you preparing yourself and your employees for this?

I think it's very, very important to learn for yourself. So this is personnel development for our HR department. We are looking at technological developments ourselves, at possible uses for AI and are also trying things out on ourselves, so to speak. In this way, we want to stay ahead of the wave as best we can and not swim behind it.

It is clear that vocational training and further education in the port must also change dynamically due to the rapid technological developments.One specific project in this context is PortSkill 4.0. Can you briefly explain what this is about?

As the name suggests, the project deals with skills and competencies that will be needed in the port in the future. It's a very exciting research project that is organized in a network. It is also so exciting and important because technological developments and changes in job profiles naturally also play an important role for employee representatives and trade unions. What responsibility do we have for our employees, how does technological progress ensure that new job profiles are created and, of course, that employment remains possible?

If I have understood correctly, PortSkill 4.0 is also about developing or applying contemporary learning formats - how should I imagine such a contemporary learning format in practice?

In the project, we are exploring possibilities such as virtual reality, i.e. VR and AR technologies. It's obvious to a certain extent, because nowadays I have other options for training people for very practical assignments. This means that I no longer have to do this on the original device at the terminal, but can also do it in a protected environment. I then work with simulation devices and virtual reality to simulate emergencies such as fires on the terminal. The virtual world offers a lot of great possibilities that we are currently testing out.

Anyone who says New Work today usually also uses the terms agility and resilience.How would you explain these two much-used terms in the context of the port?

If we start with agility, then my understanding of it is a fundamental attitude with which I approach problems, namely in a more iterative approach. In other words, I feel my way forward. Agility originally comes from software development. The first thing I realized was that I could no longer plan a project for four years and only plan what the software should look like once at the beginning. Within these four years, the technology, the possibilities and the demands on solutions change. And we are now experiencing this not only in software development, but in many, many areas. Proceeding step by step, checking again and again in between to see whether we are still on the right track, incorporating feedback loops, etc.

And resilience?

Resilience is also a word that was used very strongly and frequently, especially during the coronavirus crisis. These years have contributed greatly to making us personally more resilient in certain areas. Organizations have also become more resilient - that means a certain robustness. If I have gone through crises and learned to apply new solution strategies at certain points, then this usually helps me to cope better with future crises.

Data-based decisions are a major technology trend today.To what extent do they play a role in personnel selection and also in personnel development, and will this increase?

It will definitely increase if you look at studies on the subject and what is and will be possible. We have to prepare ourselves for the fact that in future, large parts of our job, my job, can be done or supported by AI. There are already ways of integrating AI into learning formats. An AI can accompany you through your entire working day and you can ask it questions about what you have learned in a seminar, for example.

Is the topic of personnel selection also affected?

We already have ways of at least pre-screening today. There are ways of going through profiles on social media platforms beforehand. Many people have reservations about this at first because they say: I still want people to look at this when it comes to hiring people. But one won't completely replace the other. At the same time, we are also learning that working on the basis of data, especially in these initial steps, leads to good decisions.

Now we've talked a lot about change and flexibility, as if it were all a matter of course.How do you convince traditionalists to switch from old, entrenched structures to new ideas?

First of all, I think that traditionalists play a very important role in organizations, because it's not good for any company to turn everything upside down and question everything from one day to the next. Certain things have become established and work well. In this respect, I always find it very important to deal with resistance in this sense and with this attitude. It's important and provides a good counterbalance to everything that you want to change in a hurry. People who perhaps play an important central role and are critical of innovations should be brought to the table and taken seriously. These people often have good advice on what must not be lost in all the new things that are coming. This is usually also an incentive, if you like. It ensures that people feel they are taken seriously.

But if someone outright refuses to develop further, does pressure and other unpleasant consequences come into play?

Further development is not an end in itself. There is usually a reason why individuals need to learn something new. And it's very important that managers stay in contact with their employees, explain to them why it's so important to learn certain things and get involved. Anyone can say, I'm going down this path or I can't and don't want to go down it at this point. Then we at HHLA are a company that is very keen to have good discussions with employees. We look to see where there may be other opportunities where these people can be better deployed, where there is a better fit between what the person wants and can do and what the company needs.

Ein Faktor dafür, dass sich jemand weniger flexibel zeigt, kann fortgeschrittenes Alter sein. Muss man die Personalentwicklung also an die Altersstruktur eines Unternehmens anpassen? Und wie kann man bei der Fortbildung besonders auf ältere Beschäftigte eingehen?

Erst mal will ich sagen, dass ich ältere Beschäftigte nicht als lernunwillig erlebe. Im Gegenteil! Oft haben Kolleginnen und Kollegen, die nur noch wenige Berufsjahre vor sich haben, gerade ein ganz großes Interesse, zum Einen neues zu lernen, aber auch ihr Wissen und ihre Erfahrung weiterzugeben. Was wir zum Beispiel machen, das sind Mentorenprogramme. Wir bringen gerne Nachwuchskräfte zusammen mit erfahrenen Kolleginnen und Kollegen. Die lernen beide was dabei, und das ist total schön zu sehen.

People from a wide variety of cultures and countries of origin work together at HHLA and in the port.How does HHLA deal with challenges of a linguistic and cultural nature?

Well, the first and most important thing is that we clearly position ourselves for respectful cooperation, for a non-discriminatory working environment that is characterized by mutual respect. Regardless of origin, skin color, age, gender or other characteristics. Everyone has a home here at HHLA. HHLA is colorful and should remain so.

Nevertheless, there are still some problems, such as linguistic ones.

Yes, and that's why I'm very pleased that some time ago we created a dedicated unit to develop strategies to make the most of this diversity. The first thing my colleague told me was that it's about clearly demonstrating that diversity is a huge advantage, and also a competitive advantage for us as a company. There are all kinds of offers, opportunities, management training courses on how we can deal well with diverse teams and different cultures. As far as language is concerned, that is the easiest option. We offer a variety of language courses here internally, including more and more German speakers who would like to attend English courses so that they can communicate well in an international environment and with mixed teams.

But now I have to ask you about an aspect of New Work that is becoming increasingly important for many employees: the well-known work-life balance.So, how can I better balance my job at HHLA with my private life?

The most important thing is to create good framework conditions, and we have them here. Here, too, it is a great advantage that HHLA is a strongly co-determined company, with strong representatives who are also committed to good working conditions in all areas. Conditions that allow me to spend time with my family, even when I'm working the night shift at the terminal. And of course not forgetting my colleagues here in the office, who have many opportunities to work more flexibly. Working from home is still possible for us, even to a relatively high degree. Up to 100 percent home office is possible, in agreement with the manager. This gives us a lot of options and flexibility. I think that's a very important point.

So, what I have learned today is that the rapid transformation of the working world in the port brings a lot of challenges, but also opportunities for HR development and employees in New Work.A new way of working is the inevitable consequence of new technologies, so it's better to shape them actively and with foresight.I learned this from Clarissa Groß, my interviewee today.Thank you very much for that, Clarissa!

Thank you, Oliver.

The interview was conducted by Oliver Driesen on behalf of HHLA.